Episode 985: Time out—for a timely discussion about time travel
Air Date: October 7, 2026 | Host: Bob Metz
Disclaimer: The views expressed in this program are those of the participants.
Clip (Castle S06E05, “Time Will Tell”):
Simon Doyle: No, no, no! Let me go! You don’t know what you’re doing!
Kate Beckett: We know exactly what we’re doing.
Simon Doyle: Please listen to me, don’t do this, please! You have to let me go. If you don’t, a billion people will die!
Kate Beckett: Yeah? How are they gonna die?
Simon Doyle: I don’t know! I only know that they do!
Kate Beckett: Yeah, how’s that?
Simon Doyle: Because I’m from the future.
Richard Castle: This just became my favorite case. So, Future, huh?
Simon Doyle: That’s right.
Kate Beckett: Okay, so why don’t we just start with something simple like your name?
Simon Doyle: Why does everybody want to know my name? And who cares? It doesn’t matter.
Kate Beckett: Humor me.
Simon Doyle: Fine. You can call me Simon. Simon Doyle.
Kate Beckett: And what year are you from exactly?
Simon Doyle: 2035.
Kate Beckett: Castle.
Richard Castle: Don’t tell me you weren’t wondering.
Simon Doyle: Look, after the Bloody Energy Wars of 2031, we finally managed to cultivate new sources of power.
Richard Castle: Energy wars.
Simon Doyle: Yeah, neofascists come to power, try to control the world’s energy supply for a select few. Don’t worry, we defeat them. Turns out that one of these new sources of power is a tachyon generator. That just opens doors in a time stream continuum, allowing us to travel back in time. But of course, because of the possibility of abuse, it was tightly regulated and kept secret from the public. Look, look, I’m a temporal anthropologist. What we do is we travel back in time and we study culturally significant errors. Ancient Egypt, Middle Ages. Man, I’ve been in Nazi Germany.
Richard Castle: Aren’t you worried about the butterfly effect? Accidentally changing something in the past, thus altering the future.
Simon Doyle: No. We’re careful. The time stream is mostly self-correcting, okay? Any small changes, like a little ripple in a fast-moving river, right? Gone in a second, doesn’t matter. But if someone wants to do something big, if someone was to do something massive, then yes, of course, damn right you could change the future. And by the way, that’s exactly what just happened. What matters is that I get out of here, okay? Because it is not too late. I can still stop this. But you have to let me go now, okay? I only have a few hours before they recall me.
Kate Beckett: You’re gonna be delayed.
Simon Doyle: Oh, no.
Richard Castle: Recall you?
Simon Doyle: This is painful. I mean, I’m talking to people who still think the Earth is flat.
Javier Esposito: Hey, his fingerprints are a match for the ones we pulled from the crime scene. No question he’s our guy.
Kate Beckett: Yeah. No kidding.
Simon Doyle: You’re making a huge mistake!
Kate Beckett: Castle.
Richard Castle: Yeah.
Kate Beckett: For the sake of our future, please tell me you don’t believe that guy.
Richard Castle: Oh, no, but you gotta admit it’s a great story.
Kate Beckett: Really? I thought it was kind of derivative.
Richard Castle: Yeah, like a mashup of 12 Monkeys and Terminator.
Kate Beckett: Yeah, but it’s the way he told it.
Bob Metz:
Welcome everyone. It is Wednesday, October 7th, 2026. I’m Bob Metz, and this is Just Right. Broadcasting around the world and online. Join us for an hour of discussion that’s not right wing. It’s just right.
I’ve always written off the notion of time travel in the science fiction sense of literally moving from one period in history to another as a metaphysical impossibility. Given the popular assumption that “time” moves at the speed of light, we assume that when we look at a star or a celestial body that is, say, 20 light years away, that we’re seeing that object as it appeared 20 years in our past, since it took that long for the light from that star to reach us. And even if we could travel faster than the speed of light at 186,000 miles per second, the theory of relativity suggests that we can only move forward in time at a rate of time relative to that of the point of origin. And let’s face it, any self-respecting time travel sci-fi fan knows all about the butterfly effect, right? The idea that if you could go back in time to affect events in the past, that the present as we know it would be irrevocably altered forever.
Now, if that argument seems eminently logical to you, as it always did to me, I suggest that you prepare yourselves to have your time stream radically altered by the end of today’s show. And with that cryptic warning in mind, it’s time to jump down one of the deepest rabbit holes that we can imagine. Time travel, alternate dimensions, and a few extraterrestrials tossed in for good measure.
And it all starts right after we take a bit of time to remind you that you can write us at feedback@justrightmedia.org. Hear us on WBCQ and on channel 292 shortwave. Follow and like us on your favorite podcast platform, and visit us at justrightmedia.org, where you can access all of our social media links, archived broadcasts, and the support button that makes it easy for you to support the show. Because as always, your financial support is appreciated and is what makes this show possible.
So, let’s take some time out from talking about political crises for a timely discussion about time itself, and consider why this is much more than just an academic issue or a fantasy sci-fi form of entertainment.
In fact, this metaphysical issue is profoundly critical to philosophical and religious foundations and bodies of belief and thought. And this isn’t our first foray into the Time Tunnel, which by the way was the name of an excellent but short-lived time travel sci-fi television series in the ’60s. In fact, we’ve jumped down this rabbit hole several times, going all the way back to our earliest broadcasts. But following one of those broadcasts on this theme, Robert Vaughan and I got into an interesting discussion about the nature of time that kind of left us both a bit unsatisfied, or perhaps not convinced that our perspectives were completely sufficient. Part of the problem, I think, was that we could each see the other’s point and couldn’t really refute it, and most importantly, we couldn’t reconcile one perspective with the other, yet both made sense.
My spin was that there’s no time like the present, and that only the present actually exists. The past and future are mere human abstractions. Existence has no beginning or end. Everything “happens at once.” In the eternal present, there is no past and no future, in the metaphysical sense that any of us experience or understand through our personal journeys through time. However, Robert’s concern was that even if so, the past at least had to be somehow connected to the present, in the sense that what exists now is essentially the result of that past.
Both the past and present would therefore be necessarily intertwined in some way to create what we define as existence. And it was at this point that we resorted to discussing the concept of a space-time continuum, while applying our knowledge of philosophical principles rooted in metaphysics and epistemology. But as interesting as it was, it still left us with an uncompleted picture or vision of how the universe or existence can reconcile this seeming paradox.
So you can well imagine my shock and surprise when I happened across a discussion that perfectly illustrated and described what both Robert and I contended, and in a way that very unexpectedly validated both of our hypotheses. But nevertheless, for the purpose of our discussion today, I am going to suspend any disbelief I have about the science and physics and technology involved, because it’s all sci-fi to me.
But even if it all turns out to be fictional, and this is important, the fictional description itself reveals a remarkable way of illustrating and connecting the present with the past and the future. On the September 26th edition of Redacted, hosted by Clayton Morris, he interviewed Jorge Pabon, who goes by the initials JP, since his first name is spelled J-O-R-G-E. Certainly no expert on the science or technology involved, JP was a U.S. military paratrooper, considered a kind of whistleblower, except for the fact that he says he’s had official permission to go public with some things but not with others. And that may have accounted for the calm and carefully chosen words he used when responding to questions by Clayton Morris. And I’ll tell you, this conversation did not go in the direction that I expected, especially when it came to the seemingly irresolvable issue of the butterfly effect.
But what caught my interest and attention was that even if fiction, as our character Castle put it in today’s opener, it’s a great story. And it creates a great metaphor that seems to reconcile several differing views on the nature of time, more accurately referred to as space-time, and the universe itself. Now I should point out that as Clayton Morris begins his introduction to this topic, he cites what he calls giant portal rooms that you can see on the right side of our online image associated with this week’s broadcast. That image itself was created by his guest JP using AI to reproduce how he recalls what he saw. But the UFO depicted on the left side of our image was something apparently seen by thousands and photographed by hundreds over the city of Tehran in Iran recently.
How they might connect to each other is a story that will unfold over the course of the show today, beginning with this trip into the time tunnel, or should I say time portal?
Clip (Redacted, September 26, 2026):
Clayton Morris: Does the U.S. government have secret time travel technology? I know it might sound like science fiction to the lay person, but to members of the U.S. military who’ve actually witnessed these time travel rooms at U.S. military bases, it’s anything but science fiction.
In fact, our next guest has seen it with his own eyes. Seen this sort of giant Grand Central Terminal with giant portal rooms with different dates above them, and individuals coming in and out dressed in period clothing, walking through different wormhole time periods, carrying out specific duties as part of a secret space program, other off-the-books projects within the United States government. And are these being housed at certain military locations, military bases in the United States?
Again, I know it might sound incredibly far-fetched, but now we have documents, and we have newly released documents as part of this ongoing release of documents from the White House and the federal government, which shows the defense intelligence reference documents with transversible wormholes, stargates, and negative energies, which seems to confirm what our next guest told us about a year ago here on Redacted. So now we have federal documents backing up what he says he saw, and the documents confirm what he saw.
So Jorge Pabon is that individual, better known as JP. He came forward a short time ago and finally released his name and face to the public, and has a deep history in the United States military and these secret space programs, and has seen some incredible things. And we wanted to have JP back on to talk about the time travel component, these new documents, and what our government actually has. JP, welcome back to the show. Great to see you, my friend.
Jorge Pabon: I’m happy to be here, Clayton. It’s been a long time since December we’ve been on, and we spoke about these matters, and after we spoke, they started dropping the files like crazy. File one, file two, file three, we’re up to six.
Clayton Morris: So maybe first you can explain what you saw in these time travel rooms at these military bases with your own eyes.
Jorge Pabon: Sure, Clayton. July 6, 2023. I went to a place. I did this update with Dr. Salla. And what I saw was really close to Eglin Air Force Base, connected to Eglin Air Force Base. We got 7th Group Special Forces unit. That’s where I was located. That’s where my unit was.
Clayton Morris: So, somewhere in Alabama, this location. Describe how you arrived at this location and what’s so special about this location.
Jorge Pabon: There’s a lot of technologies involved in this location where I went with multinational. Right now, we’re having a United Nations meeting right now, and the president’s speaking there. I saw a lot of multinational soldiers. It’s not just the American soldiers. Spanish speaking, Portuguese speaking, French, everybody that’s involved with the United Nations. And these soldiers that I saw, they all were dressed similar to pilots or different uniforms, camouflage uniforms. And some of them were civilians, scientists or doctors that also had the opportunity to go to these locations.
And once I entered into this cavern looking, and it looked super high-tech inside this cavern, there’s different rooms, compartments of different technology. And when I entered, I saw pictures of what I saw: President Donald J. Trump. I saw the vice president, and then you have all these other officers that I wasn’t familiar with. But in the corner of the room, I saw a picture of Elon Musk. I’m like, what the heck? What the heck is he doing there? So I’m not sure if his picture was there because he’s helping out with these types of technology, or they’re investigating these types of technology with him and others.
I saw other pictures that I did not recognize of high-tech people that are involved with higher technology. It’s like a federal building, and you had to have a clearance to get into this building. They check you up. You gotta follow this red line. The green line is heading out. You follow this red line. They tell you to look forward. It’s like a TSA on steroids. They check you up. You go through these oval machines that are like a tunnel similar to an MRI machine, but it’s massive, and you go through these machines, they check you out. You gotta leave all your stuff, your phone, your watches, your wallets, everything behind. You don’t take nothing inside this, even the glasses. If you wear glasses, you leave the glasses out. They’re really precise who enters into these types of caverns or buildings that they have underground in this location in Alabama.
A lot of different technologies involving robotics, AI, AGI, artificial general intelligence connecting with satellites, also a lot of portal-looking technologies, and that’s the room when I entered. My jaw dropped. I was like, what the heck am I seeing here?
Clayton Morris: So, how large would you describe this room?
Jorge Pabon: Like a football field type of room. Yeah, it’s huge. It’s a huge room, but halfway in it has different compartments, and inside you have other people doing research from different nations, doing research on technology, I’m sure different types of weapons, different types of anti-gravity. And this is also part of the location that is connected to these people that look Nordic training Air Force pilots how to fly these types of UFOs that we talked about in December.
Clayton Morris: Can you describe how long you were in this room, and maybe just be very specific, like what you saw with these shimmering portals, the dates and times, and the people walking through from these different time periods?
Jorge Pabon: I saw people with futuristic clothing. I saw scientists with white robes with uniform. Everybody had a type of happiness of being there, like they were happy, but there were some people that were really serious, and then you had the aggressive people looking at you, watching you, like Secret Service type of feel, really looking at you to see what you’re looking at, or why you’re there. So you have a security team that is so aggressive that it’s really looking at everybody, of how they do or what they do in this location, so you’re always being watched.
Clayton Morris: Did you get a sense of why you were in this room?
Jorge Pabon: Well, they wanted me to go through these portals, but I did not feel safe. I have a family, and I said no. Some other people said yes, and they were telling me—I was telling them, “Hey, can you change the past? If you go through these portals or time machines or whatever?” They were telling me, no. If you went through these portals, it’s like you already went through already, so it’s not affecting the future or past. If you go through, it’s because you went through already. So it kind of clicked in that it’s not gonna affect the future because it already happened.
Clayton Morris: That’s crazy.
Jorge Pabon: So, whatever, yeah. So it’s like what came first, the chicken or the egg type of scenario. So some people say, oh, like Back to the Future. If you go back in time, you’re gonna change and erase people, but it doesn’t work like that. If you go back into time, that means it already happened. But what came first? You going back to the future, or you know? So it’s really confusing when you get into the entanglement part of it.
Clayton Morris: So you didn’t want to do it. You were offered to go. Did they tell you what time period you were gonna go to?
Jorge Pabon: They wanted me to go to the 1940s. Don’t know why. But deep inside, I always had a connection with the 1940s, with Dean Martin and the clothing and all that. I don’t know why, but they were pointing out the 1940 for me, and I denied it, and they wanted me to sign all these papers. And then I thought in my mind, is this how people get disappeared?
Clayton Morris: Yeah.
Jorge Pabon: So I decided, I have a family, and if something does happen—they said also, if something does happen and you don’t come back, it’s not our fault. So I’m like, okay, I’m good.
And I did see people coming out from the 2090. And they looked really futuristic. They had these futuristic helmets. It’s like exoskeletal type of uniform. They had different insignia on, and they really look futuristic coming.
Clayton Morris: From the 2090s?
Jorge Pabon: 2090s.
Clayton Morris: That’s crazy to think that that’s only like 65, 67 years away. And why did you think they had helmets on? Was it something to do with the environment? Air quality?
Jorge Pabon: Don’t know what location or where they were coming from. I just saw the year 2090. It doesn’t necessarily mean if it was on Earth or somewhere else. I’m sure we’re gonna be on the Moon and Mars by that time. We’re gonna build these space stations over there.
Clayton Morris: That’s incredible. Okay. It’s a lot to digest.
Jorge Pabon: Yeah, and we’re gonna hear it again from the people in the comments. But I think if people do their research on what’s being dropped right now and why it’s being dropped right now, I think disclosure is really, really happening.
Bob Metz:
There’s still another round to go from this conversation between Clayton and JP, and I will reserve my thoughts on the whole disclosure process after that round. But personally, I thought JP’s narrative made for a great story, and you’ve got to admit it sure messes with your mind. I mean, there’s no other way to summarize this other than by saying that if any of us ever experience time travel, it will only be because we already did it. In fact, it only logically follows that “we already did everything we’re doing right now and we’ll do tomorrow.”
Which brings me to a very important point to make before continuing with this topic. As far as I can tell, there is no adequate language that we have yet devised to properly or objectively define and describe the nature of space-time and all of its implications. That is, in the intended context of making critical distinctions between our generally accepted concepts of time and what is being proposed here.
Human beings have a very unique relationship with time. Humans often view time as a possession, like when somebody says, “Hey, have you got some time to spare?” When we all really know that each of us is very time limited. In fact, we don’t possess time. Time possesses us. And if you’ve ever heard the saying, “Time is the fire in which we all burn,” I think you’ll appreciate what that means in real time.
So I just wanted to get that basic language disclaimer in before concluding with a conversation between Clayton Morris and Jorge Pabon, which starts heading in yet another unexpected direction.
Clip (Redacted, September 26, 2026):
Clayton Morris: So maybe any other conversations you had while you were there. You told them you weren’t interested. Did they tell you what the mission might have been in the 1940s?
Jorge Pabon: No, they did not say nothing about the missions. Once they go through the portal, you do whatever they tell you to do, whoever’s there already, and then you come back and report. Time goes really different when you go through these portals.
Clayton Morris: What do you mean?
Jorge Pabon: When it’s dealing with time or different timelines, time is different. An hour can be a couple days, depending on when you come back or how you come back.
Clayton Morris: When you walk through it, you could actually be skipping a week, losing a week.
Jorge Pabon: Yeah, you can be skipping a week or losing a week, or three or four days ahead or behind, depending on where you’re going in this time loop.
They were saying a lot, they were talking a lot about saying time loop or something like that. That this already happened. Everything that is happening is already happening at once. So everything is connected. Every timeline is connected as one.
Clayton Morris: So it’s not a linear, and we’ve heard that from different physicists who believe it’s not a timeline, it’s all connected. So.
Jorge Pabon: It’s like a spaghetti ball. That’s how they explained to me how it looks. Everything is intertwined with each other. Every timeline is intertwined with each other. The future, the past, the present, everything is at once. And I think once people do the research on everything is happening at once, people will understand how these time machines work or these technologies. I got an idea, but I’d rather not get into it. I’m not a scientist. I was just a paratrooper.
Clayton Morris: Yeah. So anything else that they told you when you were in this room? Anything else that stood out to you?
Jorge Pabon: Well, they’re also—I was talking to a soldier over here in Hurlburt Field, and we were talking about this technology from Hurlburt Field. We talked a little bit, and I talked to another soldier that is involved in Hurlburt Field, and he told me that they’re gonna move most of this technology we have in Alabama to Greenland when they start building these military bases over there in Greenland.
Clayton Morris: I’m just blown away by the time travel piece of this. I mean, and the fact that it works in this time loop rather than a linear path that you could go back and affect the timeline, because people say, well, you’d go back and shoot Hitler or whatever.
Jorge Pabon: Yeah, you can’t, because it already happened. So I think it’ll find a way that everything stays the same. So if you go back in time, it already happened.
Clayton Morris: So what is the purpose then, do you believe, of these rooms? Did you get a sense of, is it just to observe? Like if these people are—
Jorge Pabon: Information of technology, information of political people that are gonna arise, different information on types of ETs that are gonna present themselves. And I think it’s to be ahead of the game.
Clayton Morris: So where do you think we’re going with disclosure? What are you seeing coming out? Maybe things that have just started coming out over the past few weeks that are trigger points for you.
Jorge Pabon: Technology involving artificial intelligence is gonna be a really big deal. We got different types of companies also building types of medbeds that will help people get cured of a lot of different diseases. We got a lot of different medical breakthroughs coming out in the beginning of next year that is gonna help a lot of people out with certain types of diseases and all.
Also, hopefully they will drop the contact part of disclosure, of interacting with these ETs, these extraterrestrials. Hopefully they’ll drop that for the public. They’re trying to normalize it right now. I don’t know if you’re seeing all these movies like The Age of Disclosure. They’re trying to normalize it right now.
Clayton Morris: So a lot of this has been slowly being unpacked over the years, and the just casual people, even at dinner parties. We were at a dinner party a few weeks ago, just talking about disclosure and alien technology, and they were like, “Oh, yeah, we believe it. Yeah, of course we have these craft.” Like if you would have said that 15 years ago, those people would have been like, “Well, you’re nuts,” and now it’s kind of like, yeah, we all believe we have this stuff now. So I think that this pre-programming has been working.
Jorge Pabon: Everything happens for a reason. I think soon there’s gonna be a presentation of a craft that we have, and they’re gonna show the public what we’re really back-engineering. I think that’s gonna be a plus.
Clayton Morris: You think that’s coming? Well, we’re gonna see a craft, and you’re gonna have members of Congress or somebody showing us we have this thing.
Jorge Pabon: I believe that that’s coming up. That’s gonna open the minds of a lot of people that this is real. Excuse my French.
Clayton Morris: Well, even Congressman Burchett just the other day, based on the Iranian sightings, said that he believes that these are reverse-engineered off-world vehicles. So more and more members of Congress who’ve been talking to whistleblowers, who’ve even heard things, seen things. Yeah, I hope it’s coming. I hope it’s coming.
Jorge Pabon: Yeah, disclosure is happening. Just keep your head on a swivel.
Clayton Morris: JP, great to have you here, my friend. Thank you so much.
Clip (Logan’s Run S01E05, “Man Out of Time”):
David Eakins: Almost five minutes to spare. May I have the tapes? Do any of them say anything about my personal future? After I returned to my own time.
Rem: In a sense.
David Eakins: Were you able to learn the reason for the Holocaust?
Logan: No. It may be that we didn’t know what to look for.
David Eakins: What you said about my going back to a dead world. I’m not sure anymore.
Jessica: None of us are sure. How could you stay? Never knowing if you could have saved all those billions of lives.
Rem: It’s one thing we did learn, that you had returned to your own time.
Logan: You’d never have been chosen for this if you didn’t understand what you had to do.
David Eakins: And if in the end I succeed? None of you will have ever existed.
Jessica: We’re still here.
David Eakins: So, nothing’s really changed.
Logan: Well, he had to try. There was no other choice.
Rem: I think this will be of great interest to us.
David Eakins: My dear friends. Jessica. Logan. Rem. When you play this hundreds of years from now, you’ll know that I’ve failed. And I’m sending this recording forward to you through time. The nuclear war is going to happen. It’s already started. And finally I know the reason. I started it. When we announced the success of our time travel experiments, the world came apart. They began to realize that you could travel back as well as forward in time. That world leaders could be killed before they became important. The time machine became the ultimate weapon. Our enemies decided on the first strike in order to prevent our using it. The bombs have already started to fall. The world is doomed.
I could have come back to you instead of sending this, but I know that I don’t belong there. Your time belongs to you. Too much of my civilization is inside me. Don’t give up.
Logan: It was his discovery of time travel that destroyed the world.
Bob Metz:
You’re listening to Just Right, broadcasting around the world and online.
Actually, it was not his discovery of time travel that did it. The plot of that very episode of the TV series Logan’s Run already demonstrated that time travel would change nothing in the experienced present. I mean, if they had had the chance to actually use their supposed time travel weapon before destroying each other, they would have similarly discovered that after its use, nothing would have changed. Or in other words, the war would have been all over nothing. But of course, that’s all just fiction.
Now, once again, disclosure is happening, says JP. But my constant issue with this statement is exactly what constitutes disclosure. How would we know it when we see or hear it? Is only information with an official seal of government approval on it considered to be disclosure? Because if so, then disclosure could mean anything from disclosure to concealment and secrecy.
I’m still waiting for a disclosure on the COVID plandemic. I’m still waiting for a disclosure on the vaccine deaths and injuries. I’m still waiting for disclosure on the climate change hoax and agenda. In fact, I’m still waiting for disclosures on everything from the Kennedy assassinations, both of them, to 9/11.
And yes, there have been various official government statements and decrees over the years, including promoting the use of the term conspiracy theory as a pejorative and as a weapon to dismiss narratives inconsistent with the official one.
But thankfully, the real disclosures are being made by average people outside of direct government influence. Right now in Canada, the Allison Inquiry just wrapped up, documenting hundreds of personal disclosures of people testifying under oath about the injuries they’ve suffered as a direct result of the COVID injections. But of course, until the government puts its seal of approval on their narratives, those things really didn’t happen, right?
Even on the UFO and ET front, there have been similar efforts being made, again by people testifying under oath, many of them being technicians, military and administrative fields.
So here’s the bottom line. Insofar as any conclusions can be drawn from all of this, that requires a process of individual discernment, because when it comes right down to it, there’s no way for any of us to personally be able to verify anything outside of our own personal observations and experiences.
But this time loop theory, or more to the point, the hypothesis, is a fascinating one, even if, as I said earlier, it is mere representative fiction. Not a timeline, but a time loop.
Could it be that our visualization of time as moving in a linear direction has really screwed up our proper understanding of its nature? But viewing time as a loop in the context we’ve heard described certainly makes any concerns about a butterfly effect completely irrelevant.
Which by the way, for those unfamiliar with the term, the butterfly effect is described by Encyclopedia Britannica Online as a term, quote, “coined by meteorologist Edward Lorenz in the 1960s while studying chaos theory, illustrating how small changes in initial conditions can lead to vastly different outcomes in complex systems, such as weather patterns. Lorenz used a metaphor of a butterfly flapping its wings to suggest that such a minor event could ultimately cause significant changes, like a tornado forming elsewhere,” end quote.
But we’re still left with irreconcilable contradictions as long as we keep applying our current notions of space-time to this new way of looking at the universe, as I warned in citing the language barrier earlier. And the challenge here is not with space-time, but with our conception of space-time and with how we represent the universe for the purpose of understanding it. In the same way that a geographical map or a roadmap is a representation, they’re not the real thing. So too, this representation of the universe as not operating on a timeline, but a time loop, is only applicable as a tool of knowledge, even though it may describe some phenomenon that turns out to be quite real.
So what is the purpose of these rooms if you can’t change things? asked Clayton, to which JP speculated, information of technology, about political people that are going to arise, information on different types of ETs that are going to present themselves. “I think it’s to be ahead of the game.” But if that’s actually the case, once again we’re confronted with a version of the proverbial butterfly effect. Because if time travel increases our knowledge, and if, as JP suggested, it’s being done to “be ahead of the game,” that implies that you’re still operating under some assumption that you can change the game with regard to some aspect in history. But no, because even if so, according to the time loop theory, it already happened, right? And if that’s so, then any talk about being ahead of the game is kind of pointless too, isn’t it? I mean, talk about a loop.
As JP described it, so it’s not a linear timeline as physicists refer to it, it’s like a spaghetti ball. Everything is intertwined, every timeline, the future, past, the present, everything is at once. And once people do the research on everything happening at once, people will understand how these time machines work.
Well, here again we find ourselves confronted with an inadequate vocabulary necessary to define or express the nature of what is being described. I mean, even the very term time travel seems to be highly misleading. In a way, we’re all traveling through time all the time. Every minute you’ve traveled through a time interval that we measure as such. After, before, during, all at once. What do these terms possibly mean in the given context of the time loop idea?
I mean, everything at once? The term “at once” implies a measurement of time itself, instantaneous, immediate. That makes no sense. Unless, as implied by this time loop theory, any part of history is always immediately accessible, which seems to be what is being said here.
And one of the reasons that all this caught my attention was how JP’s description of what he was trying to describe visually so closely resembled our own philosophical interpretation of the nature of the universe, offering us a possible way to create a visual representation that we can relate to on some level of understanding.
Way back on our April 10th, 2008 broadcast, we began that show with four basic hypotheses. One, that the universe is expanding, and the further away galaxies are from us, the faster they are receding from us. Two, that the Big Bang did not happen at some particular location in the universe, far away from us, but happened everywhere at the same time, whatever that might mean in the context of space-time. Three, the cosmological principle, which states that our view of the universe is representative, means that no matter where you are in the universe, you’ll always feel like you’re in the center. And four, that there are two differing views of the universe: the infinite universe, which expands forever in all directions, and the finite universe, which curves in on itself.
And as we discovered several years later in his 2014 book, A Guide to the Construction of the Natural Universe, author Conrad Ranzan describes a steady state theory of the universe, that space-time not only expands but also contracts. And that certainly paints a representative image of the universe consistent with what JP was describing.
But trying to define and comprehend the nature of time itself, physics and science and math are not quite adequate. And it is here that philosophy plays a key role. And here it is in a nutshell, as described by Leonard Peikoff in The Philosophy of Objectivism, and I quote:
“The universe is the total of that which exists. Not merely the Earth or the stars or the galaxies, but everything. Obviously, then, there can be no such thing as the ‘cause’ of the universe. Time is a measurement of motion. As such, it is a type of relationship. Time applies only within the universe when you define a standard, such as the motion of the Earth around the sun. If you take that as a unit, you can say this person has a certain relationship to that motion. He has existed for three revolutions, therefore he is three years old. But when you get to the universe as a whole, obviously no standard is applicable.
“You cannot get outside the universe. The universe is eternal in the literal sense, non-temporal, out of time. Space, like time, is a relational concept. It does not designate an entity but a relationship which exists only within the universe. The universe is not in space any more than it is in time. To be in a position means you have a certain relationship to the boundary of some container. For example, if you are in New York, there is a point on the Earth’s surface on which you stand. That’s your spatial position, your relation to this point. All it means to say there is a space between two objects is that they occupy different positions.
“The universe, therefore, cannot be anywhere. Can the universe be in Boston? Can it be in the Milky Way? Places are in the universe, not the other way around.”
End quote. And this is why it’s invalid to ask when did the universe begin. Both space and time exist within the universe, not outside it. Since time is a measurement of motion, that motion could only occur within an already existing universe.
And it is in this context that maybe the term time travel itself makes more sense. Everything is actually in motion. The planet Earth moving around the sun, the sun moving through the galaxy, the galaxies all in motion relative to one another. So on a universal scale, we are always “traveling” through that relationship called space-time. And this brings us to what we’ve been calling the space-time continuum, which I briefly mentioned during the opening of the show.
Contrary to first-cause premises, the space-time continuum has no beginning and no end in the sense of time itself. As we’ve observed, time is inside the universe of existence, not outside it.
So too, human beings are inside and part of nature and subject to the so-called laws of nature from which we cannot exempt ourselves. That has been determined by the very nature of existence. So in this context, the deterministic nature of the universe is valid. Which means that human will, free or otherwise, is deterministic, or as philosopher John Macmurray put it, what has been determined is that man shall be free.
And we must be careful not to confuse this kind of determinism with the human variety of determinism, which is ironically a consequence of someone exercising their will, as in, I am determined to figure all this out despite my place in the universe. Because when you’re inside some given entity that makes you part of the experiment, so to speak, it’s difficult to separate yourself from it for any kind of outside objective view.
So, are we all thoroughly confused and confounded yet? JP certainly felt that way, as he put it. I asked, can you change the past if you go through these portals or time machines? They said no. If you go through, it’s because you already did it. Now, of course, to the person operating on a linear timeline, this makes no sense whatsoever. And in fact, would represent a contradiction. I mean, if you can say the future already happened, why isn’t it just as valid to say that the present already happened? Or did I just say that? “It’s really confusing when you get to the entanglement part,” says JP. No kidding.
Now, although JP mentioned the presence of extraterrestrials in passing, in a subsequent interview that Clayton Morris conducted on the same day with Dr. Michael Salla, coming up next, they got into a discussion kicked off by the recent UFO sightings in Iran, with Salla openly admitting that no one knows exactly what these UFOs are, and then proceeded with telling us why he believes them to be of extraterrestrial origin, or maybe it’s all just politics.
Clip (Redacted, September 26, 2026):
Clayton Morris: Incredible sightings across Iran, with eyewitnesses capturing incredible videos, as we’ll show you here, of triangular-shaped craft with all sorts of lights, just hovering, almost using anti-gravity technology above Tehran and seen by thousands of people, multiple different videos popping up again over the past few days. So what are these craft? Where did they come from? And have we seen something like this before?
Joining us now is Michael Salla, Dr. Michael Salla, who writes at exopolitics.org. He’s written countless books, of course, on the subject, and he is, of course, a subject matter expert on the history of sightings in Tehran. Michael, welcome back to the show. Great to see you.
Michael Salla: Great to be back, Clayton.
Clayton Morris: Your initial thoughts when you saw these videos. What do you think they are? And just maybe high level, what did you think?
Michael Salla: Well, the videos themselves are very impressive. You see an arc of what looks like this multi-colored UFO, and it appears to have been taken by several individuals in Tehran, and it doesn’t look like it’s AI generated. I mean, we have had individuals claim that they took the photos, and so that’s actually—I posted it, as well as many others on their Twitter feeds, that people are claiming that they’ve taken these photos, and it shows an object flying over Tehran. And well, what is it? I mean, it does fit the category of a UFO. No one really knows exactly what it is.
Now, some claim that it is a craft belonging to an extraterrestrial civilization. We don’t know that for sure. Some believe it may be part of the advanced technologies that are possessed by the U.S. government, by the covert corporations involved in the studying, reverse engineering of extraterrestrial craft, and so this is being tested or is playing a role in the Iran conflict. And I think more likely it’s probably a craft belonging to some extraterrestrial civilization or some non-human intelligence that’s monitoring the conflict.
I mean, this is something that goes back many, many decades, even centuries. You find examples of conflicts on Earth where you’ve had these UFOs flying in the skies and just monitoring what’s going on. And I think that is a testament to claims that many conflicts on Earth are in fact proxy wars, where you have multiple civilizations, whether we’re talking extraterrestrials, whether we’re talking Earth, whether we’re talking some kind of interdimensional, or God. I mean, you can go back to Homer, and he talks about how the gods choose proxies in their wars among each other. The ancient Sumerian texts also talk about these wars between the different Anunnaki. They are monitoring the conflict. So that craft we saw, or that people are seeing over Tehran, could be belonging to one of these extraterrestrial civilizations, just monitoring a conflict on Earth that they are involved in to some degree.
Clayton Morris: What does this say about where this conflict is going?
Michael Salla: There are factions within the Iranian leadership that actually do work closely with the white hats, or positive elements of the U.S. military, in wanting to collaborate in terms of finding and understanding ancient technologies that are buried in Iran.
I mean, you can find the mystery schools in all different countries. I mean, you can go to Egypt, you can go to the Americas, Peru, and so forth. And there will always be these secret societies whose job it is to watch over and protect ancient technologies that are buried there from civilizations that have long been forgotten.
We shouldn’t assume that this conflict we’re watching in Iran is simply a power play between, on the one hand, the Trump administration and Israel wanting to dismantle the Iranian regime so that they can enable the Greater Israel project to expand throughout the Middle East. There is this element of ancient technologies that exist in Iran, because Iran is an ancient country going back thousands of years, long before Islam took off. And there are people in Iran that have a responsibility for watching over and protecting these technologies and making sure that they’re only used by the right people.
So it really does raise the question, well, does the present Iranian leadership kind of qualify in terms of ethics, or the kind of outlook that the secret Iranian, or Persian maybe is a better word, the ancient Persian custodians have for these technologies? Or would they want to work with people from the West or from the United States who have more of an understanding of how these technologies should be used, because they’re very powerful? I mean, just think about the potential of portal technologies which could open the doorway between our Earth and not only other dimensions, but also other worlds. And you can have very powerful beings, very powerful super soldiers, very powerful interdimensional beings coming through. Do you want those beings coming through? Do you want those beings working with the current leadership? So these are the sort of questions we should be asking.
Clayton Morris: You know, eagle-eyed observers have said, well, there was two. It looked like there was two different craft, two different styles of craft. One was sort of a circular, almost like a cylinder style. Almost looks like something out of Close Encounters of the Third Kind, as it’s spinning in a circular pattern.
And then, of course, the more triangular-shaped one that you posted as well, which has multicolored lights. And some are saying, well, these are probably government programs. They’re two different craft, two distinct platforms that match descriptions of the TR-3B Black Manta Astra, the triangular craft program. It’s a nuclear-powered anti-gravity reconnaissance program.
And then the other one, I’ve heard it described as an ARV, an alien reproduction vehicle, and that’s the circular one that we’re talking about, more of a saucer-shaped, but part of the same aerospace program. ARV, the flux liner, as it’s colloquially called.
What do you think about that? Do you think that there’s any legitimacy that these could be government programs floating over Iran to scare them out, scare them into submission?
Michael Salla: Yes, that’s very possible. I mean, we know that these craft exist, that they fly out of Air Force bases in the United States, and they fly long distances using these anti-gravity craft that are triangle-shaped or rectangle-shaped, even flying saucer shapes. They’ve got quite a collection of these craft.
And if the Trump administration wants to really deflate the morale of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards, to tell them, look, why are you guys fighting? You should be surrendering or negotiating with us. One way to do it would be to place one of these craft over the major city like Tehran and just hover there and say, look, your best technology, offensive weapons, can’t touch us.
Kind of like do something similar to what happened in Venezuela when you had that raid where Nicolas Maduro was abducted using advanced technologies to overwhelm what the Venezuelan regime could deploy, and that was regarded as a very successful operation. So we could be witnessing something similar in Iran, where the U.S. has decided to use some of these advanced antigravity craft, which have all kinds of defensive weapons or stealth or some means of being able to deflect any kind of missile targeted at it, to be able to hover and operate with impunity over Tehran. And so that would send the message that yes, we have this kind of technology, and you really need to negotiate with us. And I think the Trump administration really does want to negotiate.
Bob Metz:
So if all this seems completely BS science fiction fantasy to you, rest assured that the AI program called Grok agrees. I asked Grok, is there any truth to the existence of extraterrestrials? Its reply was, quote, “No, claims of visiting aliens remain unsupported by verifiable data. Government military UAP UFO reports do not change that assessment,” end quote.
And in citing the 1947 Roswell case, quote, “Official reviews point to a secret military balloon project, not a recovered spacecraft,” end quote.
Well, that sure makes liars of hundreds of witnesses testifying under oath during the UFO disclosure hearings before the U.S. Congress that we covered on our August 3rd, 2023 broadcast.
And of course I had to ask Grok, is there any truth to the U.S. military conducting time travel experiments? To which it replied, quote, “No, claims that the U.S. military has conducted successful time travel experiments are conspiracy narratives without credible documentary, physical or independent evidence,” end quote.
But then it added this remarkable paragraph. Quote, “General relativity permits closed time-like curves in certain exotic solutions, like transversible wormholes requiring negative energy densities that have not been shown to be engineerable. No laboratory or military result has demonstrated macroscopic time travel, and the engineering demands described in the conspiracy accounts exceed known 1940s technology by a wide margin. Occasional viral stories, army teleportation of soldiers, secret Alabama portals, etc., trace to April Fool’s items, uncorroborated interviews or secondary retellings,” end quote.
What? 1940s technology? Last time I checked my calendar, this is 2026. Was Grok responding to me from a different time loop? But the really weird part was the reference to transversible wormholes requiring negative energy densities, because that was one of the very terms used by JP in describing his technology during a very complicated part of the discussion that we didn’t include in our selection today.
So, so much for the official Grok block. But it’ll be interesting to see if anything results from all those disclosures we’re hearing about. But what would such a result even be, other than our own expanded knowledge of the universe?
And speaking of the relationship of time to this show, the temporal distance between the release of today’s broadcast and our next broadcast is seven days. So just try wrapping your head around the idea that you’ve already listened to that show, since I’ve already invited you to join us again next week, when we already continued our journey through the time loop in the right direction, before which you spent the week being right, staying right, doing right, acting right, thinking right, and ending up right back here, where we all started in the first place. See you when.
Clip (3rd Rock from the Sun S01E07, “Lonely Dick”):
Narrator: Aliens are all around us. This is the story of a band of four such explorers. In order to blend in, they have assumed human form. The Earth is populated by really beautiful women. Those who aren’t beautiful have great personalities.
Dick: What are you reading?
Sally: Vogue. Look at this. Stomachs are in, breasts are out. Well, that’s just basic anatomy.
Dick: Why don’t you look like that?
Sally: Because that woman has used a line of products that promotes moist-looking skin and a vacant look in her eyes.
Dick: Well, get some!